now democratic congressman chris van hollen. >>guest: i think a deal can be reached, the sentiment was good they had constructive talks but as you indicated --. >>neil: what made them constructive? >>guest: in the sense that all parties understood the importance trying to revent us from going over the fiscal cliff but the devil is in the details. we have had the sentiments before and they have not produced a result. so this will be some are very tough negotiating. it is obviously better that the mood is constructive than otherwise but at the end of the day, very tough compromises will have to be hammered out. >>neil: nancy pelosi said, not to touch entitlements talking generally about medicare and medicaid, and social security, and a letter circulating in the senate senators harken and rockefeller of the same sentiment. do you agree? >>guest: we have different approaches for saving money. if you save money the way we did in affordable care act by reducing costs but not simply transferring rising health care costs on to the backs